FACE TO FACE
With John Samy,
Head, Technical And Support Secretariat (TASS)
to the
National Council to Building a Better Fiji (NCBBF)
On the People’s Charter for Change, Peace and Progress (PCCPP)

1.How did you get to be part of the initial process with the proposed Charter – the setting up of the National Council to Building a Better Fiji (NCBBF) and the Technical and Support Secretariat (TASS)? On whose invitation did you get involved as I understand that you stated on Close up last Sunday that Mr Chaudhry invited you. Can you elaborate on your answer please.

I am happy to elaborate as I was not given the courtesy of an opportunity to do so in that “Close Up” progamme. Also, what I said in the “Close Up” programme has been quoted out of context and distorted in various media reports, especially by the adversaries of Minister Chaudhry.
First, a bit by way of background.
While still with the Asian Development Bank (ADB), I followed closely the developments unfolding in Fiji in recent years; and in doing so, I have been concerned about the stagnation and decline, about the growing poverty and constant instability. In September 2006 I wrote to Ratu Jone Kubuabola, then the Finance Minister and formerly a fellow Permanent Secretary colleague from the mid-1980s.
At the time of the military takeover in December 2006, I was no longer with ADB; I was settled in Auckland. In January last year, Francis (Narayan) and I traveled to Wellington, at our initiative and expense, to meet with senior officials in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs; to express our concerns about New Zealand’s not only hard, but hardening stance towards Fiji. We felt that New Zealand and indeed Australia and the international community should look at ways and means to assist Fiji deal with its fundamental problems, rather than to isolate it.
Towards the end of February last year, when the Interim Government was working on its Road Map for the restoration of democracy, I was contacted by Minister Chaudhry. It was then, and remains now, my clear understanding that the invitation for my involvement originated from the Prime Minister; that Minister Chaudhry contacted me only upon the express request of the Prime Minister.

2.The question that people are asking is how much are you being paid as there is a speculation that you are being paid $30,000 a month?
This is a matter on which there seems to be a lot of speculation and interest. I should therefore respond appropriately and with due transparency.
First, let me be very clear: I am not being paid $F30,000 a month for the role of Head, Technical and Support Secretariat (TASS). When asked to serve in this role, since no external funding was available, I took the initiative to volunteer to work on local (Fiji) market rates. In the international market, however, given my professional experience and accomplishments, for a regular assignment with the World Bank or ADB I would in fact be paid at least, if not more than, $F30,000 per month, plus per diem. In November last year, I did a one-week assignment in Madrid, Spain and for that I received about $US1800 per day.
What I am being paid as Head, TASS has no comparison whatsoever to these figures; i.e the rates for my services in the international market. It is very much less and this Head TASS role is no “regular” assignment.
My being here, serving in this role for NCBBF and Fiji, has nothing to do with earning money. You should recall also that in the “Close Up” programme, I indicated that for over 10 months of last year I provided my time and services free; in fact I paid for almost all of my expenses from my pocket.

3.There has been opposition to the allowances that members of the NCBBF are receiving ($100 per seating) – do you think it fair that these people are receiving such an allowance when people are struggling to make ends meet all over the country?

The allowance of $100 a day for the NCBBF members is fair. This allowance is only paid for the full NCBBF meetings. The first meeting was held on January 16, 08 and by the time the PCCPP work is accomplished i.e by the end of October 08, NCBBF is expected to meet a total of 4 to 5 times more.  The allowance is to meet reasonable expenses, at least for those who need this. Not all of the council members need such an allowance; and already a number have so indicated.  It is neither fair nor relevant to compare or contrast the NCBBF allowance to the income of other people because there is no rational basis for such comparisons.

The NCBBF members will not confine their role only to attending the full council meetings. They are serving as National Task Team (NTT) members; and they will serve at the Working Group (WG) level. They will not be paid the $100 allowance for the NTT and WG meetings. Thus the amount of time that each NCBBF member is dedicating is much more substantial than the number of days they will sit in full council.
I wish to make a plea on this issue: let us not be small-minded; please take a broader view, look at the magnitude and great strategic importance of the PCCPP initiative.

4. How many of the 35 members have decided to forego their allowances and in doing so, could you explain where these (alloances) will be diverted to?
Of the 35 members, ten (10) are from the Interim Government and they are not being paid this allowance. Of the remaining 25 members, we have received advice from five members that they will refrain from taking this allowance. During the National Task Team (NTT) meetings ten days ago, this issue was discussed. The NTTs consist only NCBBF members and, for their NTT meetings and also the forthcoming Working Groups meetings, the NCBBF members will not be paid such an allowance.

5.Knowing that there is a tough road ahead for the NCBBF and TASS in compiling the Charter through consultation, how are you handling the criticism leveled against you and all those involved?
There is a much broader base of support for the PCCPP initiative than is conveyed through some of the media reports.
Where criticisms are justified, we must take these seriously. The way  NCBBF and TASS must handle the justified criticisms is to seek to be responsive; to pay heed; and to look at ways and means through which we can address the genuine concerns raised.
However, where the criticisms are frivolous, unfounded, and motivated by narrow-minded, inward-looking or parochial agendas, we have to try hard to ignore these, to move on, and to get on with the tasks on hand. There is much to do, and it is advisable not to get side-tracked from the larger and much more important purpose of the PCCPP initiative.

6.What has the feedback been like from the PR teams which visited districts and provinces last year? Are people coming around to the idea of a Charter?
The feedback has been very good. Most of the communities consulted support the People’s Charter idea and some contributed constructive suggestions that have been incorporated in the programme of the NCBBF.

7.Could you explain how the $2.4m budget will be used?
The budget will be used on the following:

• Administrative and office expenses of TASSSalaries for mainly the local staff and a few consultantsAdvertising and public relations Consultation, feedback and community outreach activities
• Administrative and organisational costs for the meetings of the NCBBF, the 3 NTTs and the 9 Working Groups (WGs)

8.How many people declined invitations to join the NCBBF?
As of now there are 10 who did not attend the first NCBBF meeting. I should stress that the NCBBF in its first meeting resolved to keep the doors open and for dialogue to be undertaken to try and get as many of the 10 to come on board the PCCPP initiative.

9.Former Vice-President Ratu Joni Madraiwiwi said that he was approached regarding the background of the NCBBF last year and also the possibility of being a co-chair – he declined your informal approach. Can you explain why is it you approached Ratu Joni seeing as he has publicly stated that he didn’t agree with the military takeover and the military’s seizure of political power.?
I also personally don’t agree with the coups but it is in the interest of Fiji and its people that they take a forward looking view and to put in place solutions to Fiji’s fundamental problems that will provide sustainable results.
Ratu Joni Madraiwiwi is a prominent and respected leader on the national stage. He is a very key stakeholder about Fiji and its future.

9.The SDL party and the Methodist Church have stated their opposition to the Charter.  Seen as both represent a large number of Fijians, do you think that views from many Fijians may not be included in the Charter if these two organisations don’t participate in the process?
The NCBBF has decided to continue to keep its doors open to the SDL and the Methodist Church even though their leaders have declined. The NCBBF community outreach teams have access to the communities at the local level,  and they have not been rejected. Also efforts have been made to start and or continue to dialogue with those who remain opposed. This includes SDL and the Methodist Church.

10.Political parties have said time and again that the Charter should be named the Fiji Labour Party manifesto as it is speculated that Mr Chaudhry is behind the whole idea and concept of the Charter – could you confirm or deny this please?
It is neither appropriate nor sensible for someone like me, who has no associations with any political parties, to respond to questions like this.
What I can say is that if the Interim Prime Minister Commodore Bainimarama did not believe in this, if he did not have full ownership and commitment to the People’s Charter concept as the way forward for Fiji, then the Charter initiative would not have seen the light of the day.

11.Who is the brains behind the concept of the proposed Charter?
I have already referred to the originating role of the Interim Prime Minister. Also we have comments and suggestions  from many people who responded to the first public draft Consultation Paper on the People’s Charter proposal issued in May 2007. Now that the process is underway, it should be through the collective will of Fiji’s people, that will determine the make up of the PCCPP.

12.The same political parties say that instead of calling it the People’s Charter for Change, Peace and Progress, the interim Government, FLP, military should just turn it into a manifesto and let the people decide through elections if they agree with the policies and concept of the Charter – your comments please.The people of Fiji will decide acceptance of the charter or otherwise in a referendum. 

13.Given that elections date been set for March 2009 and the interim government wants the Charter in place before the elections happens – with barely a year left till the elections do you think this ample time to formulate and implement the Charter?
It is anticipated that the political parties that will contest the March 09 general elections will all  have manifestos in which the contents of the  People’s Charter contents will dominate. This is if they are to be responsive to the collective will of the people of Fiji.
The NCBBF work plan aims to complete the Charter work well before March 2009. The work programme will be reviewed as we progress along, and the sequence of activities may change, but the NCBBF seeks to complete its work programme in 10 months, that is within the election timeframe.

14.The  Interim PM has said last week that only God knows when the elections will be held – do you think will be held in March next year based on the Charter?
The Interim Government has expressed its commitment in an international agreement to have a general election by March 2009. Only God knows why this point has still not registered into the brains of some journalists.

15.Will future governments have an obligation to follow the Charter after elections? I ask this because the SDL party has gone on record in the past saying that whatever government that comes into power can easily dismantle and do away with the Charter – can that happen?
If the Charter is endorsed in a referendum then it will have moral and indeed legal force on future governments to implement what the majority have said or what they want. This question will need to be posed to the political parties that contest the election and the  elected government in 2009.

16.The interim PM has stated that the Charter will take care of people like former PM Mr Qarase and would prohibit corrupt people from standing in the elections – could you explain how exactly this will be done?
The electoral regulations on election corruption that the Attorney General has said will be formulated before the General Election will address this issue. I am not in a position to enlighten you on any detail at this early stage of the PCCPP process. Electoral reform is on the agenda of issues to be addressed by the NCBBF.